December 29th, 2008Seattle Housing – Microsoft Layoffs And Mortgage Walk Aways
By some accounts, the Seattle housing market has held up very well during the last few years. Talk to any real estate agent or loan officer in Seattle, and they still seem completely oblivious to the reality of the collapsing bubble. But measuring objectively with actual data points tells a different story. The Case Shiller housing value index is one widely available objective method. The index values are measured off of the base of January 2000 prices, where all cities are given a value of 100.
According to the index, Seattle housing peaked in July 2007, with a value of 192.30. This means that housing prices were 92% more expensive in July 2007 than they were in January 2000. The latest available index reading is from September 2008, with Seattle showing a value of 172.84. This corresponds to a greater than 10% housing price depreciation in Seattle in just over a year. April 2006 showed a Case Shiller index reading of 172.28, the closest point to the September 2008 data point. This means that that nearly everyone that purchased a Seattle home after April 2006 is now underwater.

In California, we saw that many underwater home “owners” opted to just walk away. And by one account in Seattle, that walk away trend has already started. The Geldpress team recently interviewed one highly paid Microsoft employee who just made his last and final mortgage payment in November. “Mr Microsoft” (identity protected) purchased a condominium near his Microsoft employer in December 2007 for just under $350,000.
He was a first time home “buyer”, and like many first time “buyers” he didn’t put a single penny down. His particular mortgage was a 30 year fixed with an interest rate of 6.125%. His initial total payments, including mortgage and property taxes were $2,600. This was a condominium, so he also paid almost $300 in association fees, bringing his total monthly outlay to about $2,900. But several months after the purchase, he witnessed two payment hikes. The first hike was in his monthly association fees, which were jacked up by nearly $100, as is very common with new condominium conversions. The second hike was from the lien holding bank, who insisted he spend an additional $400 per month in mandatory flood insurance. This brought his total monthly outlay to nearly $3,400. For comparison, “Mr Microsoft” estimates that he can rent an equivalent size and quality apartment for only $1,500. He now regrets his “purchase” decision, but he does not regret abandoning his mortgage payments. He expects to live rent free for at least 6 months before eviction, and possibly up to a year.
Although Seattle housing values have held up reasonably well so far in comparison to other major cities, the recent and upcoming job losses may accelerate the down trend. According to the data reported by the Seattle PI, Washington Mutual is shedding 3,400 jobs in the Seattle area. The PI also reports numerous other double and triple digit layoffs in 2008, with an increasing trend inherent in the figures. And if the rumors are correct from the Mini-Microsoft blog, thousands of high paying Microsoft job losses will be announced in January, equating to roughly 10% of its workforce. That’s hardly the ideal condition to buck the trend of crashing home prices in the Seattle area. Seattle may soon take over California cities for monopolizing the mortgage walk away headline news.
December 29th, 2008 at 11:59 pm
Why should he feel bad?
F*** em
December 30th, 2008 at 2:11 am
Portland Oregon and Seattle Washington both try to sing the same song, that Portland, Seattle and the Pacific NW won’t be affected by housing bubble…but they are last one to the party and the last ones to get the housing bubble hang over…
December 30th, 2008 at 3:18 am
I agree with David. Here in Bellingham they’re still building some very expensive condos. Who’s going to buy them? Can’t wait to see what happens this selling season.
December 30th, 2008 at 7:29 am
He is going to intentionally not pay his mortgage for 6 months. Should he not be held responsible for the deal he signed? Could he have taken in a boarder?
He should also be taxed on the amount of mortgage that he will not be paying since it’s pretty much a gift from the tax payers.
He has no integrity if he lives there for 6 months free. He’s a thief, plain and simple.
December 30th, 2008 at 8:48 am
I wonder how much Mr. Microsoft high paying salary is, but I digress. I have two friends who just got married, purchased a house at the Peak (no money down and 100% financing), just had a baby and now both were just laid off from Yahoo.
I really have no point, just sharing more woes around the slow economy.
BTW, I’m sure Mr. Microsoft and Mr and Mrs. Yahoo will be fine with there Resume flaunting MicroSoft and YaHoo.
December 30th, 2008 at 10:00 am
Reply to “He’s a theif, plan and simple”.
In my discussion with him, he already acknowledged that what he is doing he is not entirely proud of, but knows it is the best choice for him financially. Despite his high salary, (No, I won’t disclose the amount) he is still drowning from his mortgage payments. And despite his high salary, his loan should have never been made because he would NOT qualify under REASONABLE lending standards. He is a smart guy, so he should have known better. But in this case, the “thieves” are everyone that analyzed and signed off on his loan.
As for the taxes, that is no longer the case. His mortgage is a collaterized loan, so the banks can only kick him out and take the home back. They have no legal claim to his money if he refuses to pay. And because of mortgage legislation that passed last summer, he is no longer responsible for paying taxes on the losses that the bank assumes.
December 30th, 2008 at 10:31 am
You mean Micro$oft will be laying off? Oh glory be. About time those worthless “engineers” (with their MIS degrees) get out of here.
December 30th, 2008 at 3:20 pm
He’s definitely a thief or criminal, period. No matter how he talks, he voided the contract signed by himself as a highly educated professional. The only thing I can call him is stupid or ignorant. He probably not watching the news, we have been acknowledged there is a housing bubble since middle of 2006 (even 2005).
“the “thieves” are everyone that analyzed and signed off on his loan”
Don’t blame the other party who offer the interest only loan. He definitely qualified for that load as a high paid person. There is nothing wrong with the load, but there is something wrong with his personality, he can’t take the lose after he made the wrong decision.
December 30th, 2008 at 4:11 pm
Here’s hoping “Mr. Microsoft” is one of 10% who gets canned in January. Then he would have a reason for freeloading.
December 30th, 2008 at 4:15 pm
Not only do I hope he gets canned, I hope the door hits him in the ass on the way out.
December 30th, 2008 at 4:40 pm
Cut his f’in balls off!
December 30th, 2008 at 6:32 pm
[...] Year Everyone Housing News A crack in the system – A story of AIG The year of banking disastrously Seattle Housing – Microsoft Layoffs And Mortgage Walk Aways Our Bubble blindness Krugman: Keep spending! Housing can get worst 21 dumb business moves of [...]
December 30th, 2008 at 8:21 pm
for those of you who think Mr MS is a thief and the mortgage lenders have no blame…pull your friggin heads out. you are the same morons who would have us plowing head-first into a depression just to make a point. face it, the entire system was (is) flawed. every single level of the housing scam got their take and everyone is to blame…most of all the people who should know better, ie. banks, regulators, and politicians.
December 30th, 2008 at 10:25 pm
[...] prices off record 18% in past year, Case-Shiller says – MarketWatchSeattle Housing – Microsoft Layoffs And Mortgage Walk Aways – GeldpressBreaking Up Is Harder to Do After Housing Fall – NY TimesDeveloper: You can’t [...]
December 30th, 2008 at 10:52 pm
I cant beleive the bad vibes over this.
Considering what some people have got away with are still getting away with and are going to get away with, this is nothing.
You are always told to listen to professionals and the higher ups who know better than the common man. Essentially this is what the man done. If the banks were willing to give him a 100% loan its a validation of him. Surely they are not numbskulls. As we have now discovered they were.
Further why on earth did banks start to offer so obviously bendable loans? would you lend someone such vast sums of money only on their say so. No its clear culpability lays with the lender. Their is no crime or moral failure here. He has been screwed paying large monthly amounts that he has entirely lost.
Have a heart and save your anger for the system which even as you curse this poor fellow is preparing to gouge all of us even deeper.
Dont attack the easy targets, attack the right ones the so called professionals who have quite literally commited fraud and abused the system.
December 31st, 2008 at 12:37 am
Isn’t there anybody who owns, I mean OWNS, their home? No mortgage? Like don’t worry about under/above water no matter what? Like nobody can kick you out? Like big peace of mind?
When Microsoft Bill Gates built his reported $44m house, he paid for the whole thing when finished. He could get a mortgage. But he chose to pay. It’s not that he’s got the money. Just that he knows equity trumps debt.
December 31st, 2008 at 1:20 am
If the asset is not underwater, do you still consider Mr uSoft a thief?
This is purely a business decision, that is why a contract was signed! Seems to me he is being smart to walk away from a bad situation. Why throw good money at bad investment? Maybe the government can learn a lesson or two from him.
December 31st, 2008 at 7:28 pm
It doesnt matter if your house is payed for or not, the government can always take your house for not paying property taxes.
December 31st, 2008 at 8:21 pm
When his bank hiked his payment by $400 per month for flood insurance, they said: “I dare you to walk.”.
So he did.
December 31st, 2008 at 8:33 pm
Mr. Microsoft is absolutely right,decent and responsible per our legal system. His loan
is a purchase loan that leaves him no liability if he just surrender his
property. Well, consider his 6 month stay is too short. In 1990′, I lived
in a house owned by a deceased widow in Arcadia, CA for two years. All I
have to do is just paying my utility bills, without making a penny for monthly
payment and property taxes. I am not the owner, it is owned by mother-in-law
of my pastor. Its market value is $100 thousands less than the mortgage.
The offspring don’t want it and the bank doesn’t want to foreclose it.
What a waste for it is in vacant condition in terms of MacroEconomy? Consider
my role as a house-sitter to take care of the house in a sense, since nobody
wants to take over the property.
So why not for Mr. M? He is very responsible since he doesn’t just abandon
the house as an orphan?
December 31st, 2008 at 11:42 pm
There are WAY too many americans ON to the broker’s game now, and you cannot trick as many into funny money loans. Anyone sane knows that interest prices will rise…hmm… sometime in the next 10 years and if you are stupid enough to buy anything over a 2003 valuation in 2009 at some 4.5% loan, you’re in for a long term low value once rates hit 8% at some point. Don’t be stupid and pay too much everyone. Just offer prices 20% under current values and this will all right itself since homes escalated to ridiculous levels in such a short time. Shoot, if they are audacious enough to ask for a ridiculous high price, offer a ridiculous lower price. House prices are based on income and interest rates..and we all know income is NOT going up so fast! Interest rates will rise! Can’t keep them at 5% forever!
We need to let the next generation buy affordable housing. They cannot afford a starter house at 350K, and it’s not fair to make them rent forever. You also cannot bring back interest only, no down payment, or any other kind of crazy loans.
The housing market, like the tech bubble in the stock market, is not supported by fundamentals (ex: rent comparisons, fair housing prices relative to income etc) and that is why it must go back to 2002/ 2003 levels.
Always remember, look at the PRICE of the house, not the payment because if you have to leave in 5 years, and the PRICE has DECLINED, you will OWE money by just looking at the payment.
January 1st, 2009 at 4:05 am
I see the greek realtors are showing up with their moral indignation at a buyer abusing a lender, instead of the lender abusing the buyer, like has been going on for a long time. Realtors and bankers acted like criminals, imagining their worth was ten times what it sed to be, and our society is going to hate them for years to come. If you used to work shuffling money around, then zip it. People think you belong in the gutter. Commercial RE ripoff artists are going down next.
January 1st, 2009 at 4:28 am
Does anyone else find the figure of $400/mo for flood insurance a bit, shall we say, fictional? Can anyone confirm paying that much for flood insurance for a condo in Seattle? Flood insurance is subsidized by the govt and is dirt cheap.
The only reason the guy – if it’s a real person and not a fictionalized account – is walking away is not that he can’t afford the place but that it is no longer appreciating in value. Geldpress he’s not “drowning from his mortgage payments.”
Bad investment = walk away. So let’s say you borrow some money and go to Vegas. You’re not good at cards and you lose big. You refuse to pay back the borrowed funds and let the rest of society pick up the tab for you. Oh yeah, you were victimized.
January 1st, 2009 at 6:01 pm
I agree. I DID NOT go out and get myself into a staggering amount of debt, yet my tax dollars are being used to prop up those whom did. When do I get my free down payment? How do I, as a potential first time buyer, benefit from having elevated housing prices which I cannot afford and are not rationally supported by underlying economic fundementals?
January 2nd, 2009 at 4:38 am
If you are in a 100-year flood plain you are required to purchase flood insurance thanks to Federal Law for 250K or the value of the property, whichever is smaller. If you do not purchase flood insurance the lender is required to purchase it on your behalf. Usually, they purchase flood insurance from one of their subsidiaries. This insurance runs an average of about 5K / year for 250K worth of coverage and when the lender purchases it on your behalf the amount is charged to your escrow account. This causes an escrow shortage in your account that upon evaluation by the bank causes a recalculation of escrow part of your mortgage payment. Banks usually spread the payments out over 1 year (i.e 12 months). $5000 divided by twelve over six months is about $416 per month.
Mr. Microsoft will not be getting away with no consequences. He is going to be unable to purchases property by getting a loan for 7 years… possibly more. His credit will be in the trash and he will difficulty renting from large land lords (unless they get desperate). Finally, it’s technically not even stealing, because the results of defaulting (non-payment) are spelled out in the contract. The house will most likely be foreclosed through deed of trust (non-judicial foreclosure). The mortagage payment represents way over 50% post-tax debt load of a L59-L62 MSFT employee. You’d have to be making 6K a month (72K a year post-tax ~ 102K pre-tax) for it to be a conventional mortgage (30-year fixed sounds conventional). In an upside down mortage, with no-equity, about 3K of the 3.4K montly payment going towards interest/PMI/taxes/COA fees/flood insurance, and a illiquid real estate market, sticking around would be a fool’s game. Save the 40K stuff your 401(k), IRA, Roth IRA, and Roth 401(k). In 5 years you’ll be able to buy one of these places in cash. Chances are we are going to move either into massive deflation or massive inflation, short of some miracle. Either way purchasing a property in 5 years with all cash will and maybe a 401(k) loan is better than putting it into a system that caused all this in the first place.
January 2nd, 2009 at 1:44 pm
Hey Dee Snutz
“for those of you who think Mr MS is a thief and the mortgage lenders have no blame…pull your friggin heads out.”
I understand what you mean and I have anger on those irresponsible real estate brokers/agents. But case by case, here we are talking about a professional invested in the wrong time and he just walk away because he made a bad decision (actually a fool will buy at that time and these fools keeps the housing price afloat). It’s not a six pack Joe coming from nowhere, have no income job and taking the loan.
If Mr. Microsoft have bought a 60′ Plasma TV instead of a house by talking interest only loan. He walk away because his TV now worth $1500 instead of $3000 a year ago, is he a criminal? You tell me.
January 2nd, 2009 at 4:14 pm
He did not use an interest only loan read the story. It was a 30 year fixed loan. The proper question is if Mr. Microsoft had bought a 60′ plasma TV:
* with a 30 year fixed interest loan,
* with the TV and nothing else as collateral
* where if he defaults the TV is taken away from him and he is not allowed to buy get loan to buy TVs for 7 years.
After a year the equivalent TV is worth $500 while he still has 2750 left on the loan. He has $500 in cash, does he put that money towards paying off the loan or does he up to act within his right to default as specified in the contract… lets the loan company take back the TV and then turns around a buys a brand new TV for $500? Now lets say the lenders are really stupid and they let a bunch of people buy $5000 TVs with variable interest rate loans, options arms, and neg amortization loan. This drives up the price of TVs as every one is buying one, some observant people realize they can buy TVs one day for 5000 and sell them tomorrow for $6K. The banks are quite happy to keep issuing all these loans, even to people who have almost no chance of paying them back…. I think you see where I’m going with this…
What kind of a lender gave a 6.125%, 30 year fixed, 0 down loan to a first time home buyer when home prices are falling? Gee, that’s not bad business decision at all!
January 2nd, 2009 at 9:51 pm
I am surprised that people easily recognize and have a nice term (theive) for a person who elected to not to make his mortgage payment as it is not financially wise for him. He made a bad investment and it is not that is doesn’t cost anything, he has to live with this decision (bad credit rating etc).
But top financiall institution / billionare investors looting trillions of the tax payers money to cover their investment losses and I didn’t hear much. On top of that, we re-elected most of congressmen again who voted yes to this looting scheme.
January 3rd, 2009 at 6:23 am
Thanks for clarifying that on the flood insurance. It’s a bit crazy but I understand. I once had a house on the gulf coast – hurricane alley – but it wasn’t in the floodplain and my flood insurance was $150/year. I guess all those people with condos (is it even on the ground floor?) in seattle were subsidizing the cost. And I did have a flood claim during that time – best insurance I ever got.
January 4th, 2009 at 10:11 pm
Listen. The guy broke a contract which is a business decision for him to make. Businesses do this all the time, but somehow when it’s an individual making this decision, it turns into a moral issue.
He’s doing the right thing for himself and his family. If you’re paying that much each month for a property that’s falling in value and probably will never recover in our lifetimes, then who’s the idiot?
January 6th, 2009 at 1:40 pm
Exactly! He broke a business commitment and his credit score will reflect what he did. We shouldn’t have called him a thief but still if everyone does that (walk away because of a bad investment decision), our interest rate would shoot up to cover the risk of default and in which affecting other people.
BTW, I don’t know why our Congress men would vote yes on the bailout and that’s not fair to use our money bailing out those people who made wrong decisions (wouldn’t Mr. MS are one of them causing this bail out?). There are many whys floating around but no answers. And for the coming stimulus package, it is ripping off the middle class. Why? Because the tax refund is not proportional to the tax being paid. So someone paid tax of $1000 would get same refund as who paid tax $10000. Another why, the gov yearly tax revenue is about 2.4T, why don’t the gov just give full tax refund to everybody including every single co-operations instead of giving 8T to someone else? Very interesting.
January 7th, 2009 at 5:55 pm
[...] albeit controversial topic flooding the news today. One recent Geldpress article recounting of a highly paid Microsoft employee’s intention to walk away stirred up heated [...]
February 6th, 2009 at 10:39 am
[...] him contact with the Geldpress for an interview. Why was Mr. Microsoft interviewed for the post Seattle Housing – Microsoft Layoffs and Mortgage Walk Aways? Because he decided to stop paying his [...]
February 11th, 2009 at 3:25 pm
[...] recent profile of “Mr. Microsoft” and his decision to walk away from his mortgage generated quite a stir. Some were supportive, [...]
September 17th, 2009 at 4:15 pm
I don’t understand why so many of you blame the individual for our current housing market cluster F#$%. It’s not Mr.MS fault housing prices went into free fall and it made more sense for him to walk away. Anger should be directed toward the policies that allow lenders to write loans with no liability for the loans outcome.
Banks were happy to approve anyone with a pulse and why not they had very little skin in the deal. Banks wrote the loans with no obligation to hold any of them locally. Mortgages were sold, wrapped up as polished pieces of crap (CDO) and sold to foreign investors. The banks got their money and sent the note down the line. Wall Street made a fortune selling these CDO’s to China and Europe. And these banks left China, Europe, you and me to pick up the pieces of our crappy investments we were sold as gold. The Banks pushed for relaxed lending standards so they could sell more of these packaged mortgages to investors; after all they were making a fortune off of them.
The problems started when foreign investors stopped buying these packaged mortgages due to the growing default rate. Then our banks ended up stuck with these crap investments and the rest is history.
Who doesn’t dream of owning a home? When a bank approves your loan it gives validation that the applicant can afford the home. Why would a bank give a loan to someone if they couldn’t pay it back? Why direct compassion to a corporate monster and not your neighbor? It seems like we’ve all been turned against each other. Why protect the interest of companies so vigorously especially as the unscrupulous acts against consumers keep revealing themselves over and over again?
Greed got all of us here, and blaming the poor guy that walks away from his TERRIBLE loan while exonerating the policies that allowed banks to have little consequence for writing these loans is madness. I tend to think that those who protect the interest of companies even at the detriment of their own well being are the same people who make decision based on ideology without having to actually think. Who speaks for you?
September 25th, 2009 at 7:16 pm
[...] take, consider the case of Mr Microsoft, whose own foreclosure case (or lack thereof) was depicted in this article. The value of Mr. Microsoft’s condo, according to recent listing and sales data, has [...]
November 11th, 2009 at 7:48 pm
I think the banker and homeowner deserve each other.
November 11th, 2009 at 11:15 pm
Our congressman and the banks set a dangerous precedent and have lost the moral high ground necessary to our credit system. The banks made a terrible decision and rather than fail they asked for money from the government. They are breaking contracts left and right, albeit social contracts by taking the money.
Therefore, he should walk. This shouldn’t affect taxpayers and it isn’t his fault that it does.
I seriously doubt if it would have been clear to the public exactly what the risks were with the “off balance sheet” game the banks were playing, he probably owuldn’t have borrowed the money in the first place. Most of us had no idea how inflated values were from this excess liquidity.
So the real question is why wasn’t this clear?